Friday, June 11, 2010

Heraldic pouches continued

Thanks for all your comments! It's nice to know that we're in a community, doing research and craftwork together!

I really do not pretend to have the “definite” answer, but I'm inclined to think that it's embroidery rather than knitting. Chris L., thanks for pointing the Spanish pillow out to me and dropping the word “long-armed cross stitch! This reminded me of some sources that were “sleeping in my archive”. I happened to make a scan of the Spanish pillow some time ago, which clearly shows the changes in direction you refer to. The changes are not only at the edges of each square, but also occur within the heraldic motives. With my knowledge of knitting, I think it's technically not possible to change directions like this.


Image from Gomez-Moreno, M (1946), El panteon real de las Huelgas de Burgos, Madrid: Consejo superior de investigaciones cientificas, Instituto Diego Velazquez

There are two papers on long-armed cross stitch by the Westkingdom Needleworkers Guild. Do take a look at them, because they also contain pictures of the Spanish pillow and a close-up of a purse in long-armed cross-stitch which looks very similar to that blogged by Racaire (this close-up also shows the surface “ridges” which surprised me so much)

http://wkneedle.bayrose.org/Articles/cross_stitch.html
Westkingdom Needleworkers, thanks for these papers!!!

So, it may be long- armed cross stitch (or a chain stitch?), which allows you to changes directions

Racaire also suggested the technique might be similar to that used in a “Codex Manesse” pouch. I saw this pouch a few years ago, fell in love with it instantly, and made a copy myself :-). This pouch is made using “versetzter gobelinstich” and couched goldwork.

A picture and a description of the original can be found in:
Schneider, J. (1975), Textilien. Katalog der Sammlung des Sweizerischen Landesmuseums Zurich: Zurich: Verlag Berichthaus

The Cloisters Museum, New York, owns a similar purse, see here: Hoving, T., Husband, T., Hayward, J. (1975), The secular spirit: life and art at the end of the Middle Ages, New York: The Metropolitan Museum of Art

4 comments :

Racaire said...

Yeah, I also think that long arm cross stitch could be possible - it was one of my first thoughts...

Not to forget another technique - I would really like to point out a technique very similar to chain stitch but worked in stem stitch!: "Stielstich jeweils in zwei Reihen diagonal gegeneinander gesetzt, so daß die Wirkung der des Kettstiches gleichkommt" (see Meisterwerke mittelalterlicher Textilkunst aus dem Bayerischen Nationalmuseum - Antependium "Die Anbetung der Hl. Drei Könige" - page 54+)
http://embroidery.racaire.at/?p=3292

Racaire said...

...btw. do you have a (or more) photo(s) of the original "Manesse pouch" - especially the 'front side' with the Minne pictures? I would love to try this technique and make one for me too... :D

Karen said...

It is definitely not knitting. It is possible to switch directions in knitting but it doesn't mesh with the historical record AND if it was knitting the historical knitters would be all over this piece.

I really love your blog and the beautiful work that you do. Your blog was the guilt trip I needed to finish my opus anglicanum piece :D

Isis said...

these pieces in elongated cross sticht are also interesting for comparison:

http://www.kikirpa.be/www2/cgi-bin/wwwopac.exe?DATABASE=obj2&LANGUAGE=1&OPAC_URL=&%250=43464&LIMIT=50

http://www.kikirpa.be/www2/cgi-bin/wwwopac.exe?DATABASE=obj2&LANGUAGE=1&OPAC_URL=&%250=43189&LIMIT=50

http://www.kikirpa.be/www2/cgi-bin/wwwopac.exe?DATABASE=obj2&LANGUAGE=1&OPAC_URL=&%250=9251&LIMIT=200

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